(no subject)

[vicarz]

I'm a spoilsport - I also thought I posted this in here but it seems I put it everywhere but:
Why St. Patty's day sucks:
(ignoring drunk frat boys for a minute)

St. Patty was actually English, born to wealthy parents, and taken to Ireland as a prisoner against his will. His act of 'ridding Ireland of snakes' like many biblical references was merely a metaphor - in this case it meant rid of 'heathens' the vogue term for pagans at that time. He was responsible for the usual torture and murder of thousands of people based on their religious beliefs, and celebrated by the church.

The holiday is actually on the date of his death. Oddly enough, the first St. Patty's day is rumored to have been celebrated in the US.

Comments

Yay!

[syn09.livejournal.com]

So there you go. An English religious fanatic goes to Ireland and launches a terrorism campaign against the local population inadvertantly creating an exile community in the US. After several years of institutionalized terrorism through extreme faith based initiatives, the bastard dies. Thus, there was much rejoicing. It all makes sense to me. Pass the Guinness...

[kernelpanic.livejournal.com]

shuddup and drink

[http://users.livejournal.com/_blackjack_/]

He was responsible for the usual torture and murder of thousands of people based on their religious beliefs, and celebrated by the church.

No, really, he wasn't. The conversion of Ireland was really quite painless and non-violent, compared to most of Europe. There is thought to have already been something of a Christian communiity in Ireland, particularly among the upper classes, by the time Patrick began his mission, and there isn't really any evidence of persecutions, beyond mythical stories of Druids being struck down by God for opposing Patrick. The Irish seemed pretty willing to embrace Christianity (albeit with some conscious syncretism), in part because it also entailed a reform of some of the more brutal and rigid aspects of the Irish legal and class structure.

I know it's not PC to imply that Christianity wasn't always the villain, but in Ireland it seems to have brought with it a spirit of literacy and social justice.

All saint days are celebrated on the days of their supposed deaths (e.g., Valentine's Day). St. Patrick's Day has been celebrated throughout the Catholic world, particularly in Ireland, since the Middle Ages. It was, however, a RELIGIOUS holiday. The idea of it as a celebration of Irish heritage is a creation of Irish-Americans, but that would make sense, wouldn't it? There isn't much need to celebrate your Irish heritage IN Ireland...

And he was ROMAN. His family lived in England, as Roman decurates.

Don't believe everything you read in responsed to Kangal's lj...

[lilkender.livejournal.com]

There isn't much need to celebrate your Irish heritage IN Ireland...

Actually after I posted a little anti-St. Paddy's day note in my LJ yesterday, officeninja commented and then IMed me FROM DUBLIN to say I had to update my post to say I was wrong, because he just watched a huge parade there. They do indeed celebrate.

I s'pose they feel need to celebrate their Irish heritage because for so long they were under the thumb of the British.

Shame on you, xty. is always the villain!

[vicar.livejournal.com]

But it was just so compelling!

[http://users.livejournal.com/_blackjack_/]

Oh, they do celebrate it in Ireland NOW, particularly in urban areas, but much of that was picked up FROM Irish-Americans, and to bolster the tourist trade.

Irish

[cweaselle.livejournal.com]

Blackjack is right. The Irish in Ireland didn't celebrate St. Patty's Day there until the late 20 century, if I remember correctly. I'm talking the 60's to 70's. When my grandparents went to meet their cousins they were shocked at how small the parade was. Recently the parades there have grown to match ours here because they didn't want to be out done, by the Americans. And yes that's how my cousins think of me.

As for their conversion to Christianity, the Irish wealthy did indeed pratice long before the peasants. The peasants did convert without much bloodshed because Patrick didn't say that believing in their old gods were wrong. There was much more bloodshed about the Protestant conversion than the Christian.

[oontzgrrl.livejournal.com]

I know it's not PC to imply that Christianity wasn't always the villain, but in Ireland it seems to have brought with it a spirit of literacy and social justice.

Actually that is a pet peeve of mine, so I am really happy that you brought that up. I'm not and have never been christian, and my ancestors have certainly been persecuted by christians from time to time, but to say that christianity has brought nothing good to the world is rediculous and untrue. Seriously increased literacy rates throughout europe being the first thing to come to mind. :)